The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

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The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Admin on Mon Sep 28, 2015 6:50 pm

Well done M1, you have found the first subject for discussion, now you only need to comment.

I've just been drinking with Olivier so if there are any grammatical mistakes it's his fault, not mine! Embarassed

The most prevalent topic in the news over the last few weeks has been the situation involving  Syrian/Afghan/Iraqi refugees and I'd like you to give your view on the situation as well as your view on the Migrant situation in Europe and worldwide.

What should we do? What can we do? the positives and negatives of action/inaction. Should Migrants be treated differently from refugees? Should the different members of the EU act differently? Should they act together or independantly? What role should individuals/charities/governments play? What are Middle Eastern/Asian/American countries doing and what should they do? What do you think of the German/Hungarian/Slovakian/French positions and attitudes? What about the camps in Paris and Calais? If you're not from France how is this situation perceived in your country? Do you have similar problems? What can be done about the root cause of the problem(s)? What do you think about the Lebanon camp (and conditions). Etc...

Off you go pale ...


Last edited by Admin on Tue Sep 29, 2015 6:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Amandinelau on Tue Sep 29, 2015 12:01 pm

Oh it's a BIG subject to begin the forum. I think it's a real problem for society. In fact, it's not normal that in the 21st century. For me, the problem is that : there isn't a real solution. The situation is critical but no one has a good solution. Countries are trying to find a solution but never all together. For me, a part of this solution is the cooperation. Associations trying to help migrants but it's just an "air bubble".
The situation of migrants is despair, but I think it must not be forgotten the situation of some French in the street.

Finally, the solution would be a peaceful world, since inegalities or war but it's a dream... it only remains to wait a solution and try to help us. Embarassed



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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Admin on Tue Sep 29, 2015 6:16 pm

A peaceful world cheers We can't even get a peaceful city. Evil or Very Mad
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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Amandinelau on Tue Sep 29, 2015 6:22 pm

I'm totally agree with you John. Do you have a solution ? Laughing

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Eloïse B on Tue Sep 29, 2015 7:05 pm

Amandine I don't see the link between migrants and homeless French people? And even in a peaceful world there would be migrants: people looking for a job or for a different culture/ government/...
To me, we rely too much on the government in France. We expect them to take all the decisions, to tell us what to do and to organize things, but on that kind of subject we simply shouldn't. The European governments in general take way too much time to find solutions. We can't wait for them, but act by ourselves. That's why I think some associations or people do an amazing job, taking initiatives to help refugees by their own means. They organize themselves and really act.
Try to imagine a war in France, or a very bad economic/political situation: wouldn't you leave the country when you know better places exist? How would you like to be welcomed?

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Salomé P. on Tue Sep 29, 2015 7:40 pm

Well i'm agree with Eloïse by saying that's (maybe not the best) but still a good solution to have people who take care of this society emergency problem by offer some spaces for the migrants. About the governments, of course they take too much time to react (for other society problems too by the way), but i feel they still keeping their "politic vision" and not the other one, if i can name it "human vision", the one that we see us.

I think we shouldn't give all of our attention about how and where are we gonna "split" them in our different cities. Why not thinking the problem differently and improve the creation of nomad camps around Syria or on the extremes of each European countries, where associations could act about health, administration problems and where we could, about families who are walking since many days or weeks, offer them to take a breath and after discuss about which are their situation, which country did they like to access, the possibility of admissions... to "stop" this fast flow and know better our capacities and the good solutions for everyone, for each countries, for each people.

To finish, an artistic point of view, a potential project of Banksy about transform his Dismaland parc theme into shelters for migrants. is it a real human proposition or just another provocation act?

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Alex Lasserre on Tue Sep 29, 2015 8:57 pm

Well, well quite the controversial subject here John thanks Very Happy

So what can we say about all that ? Actually, I think, it easy to talk about it, acting is something rather difficult on the other hand. And I totally agree that politicians are doing much talking and saying that we welcome with open arms migrants, but which one of these will actually welcome them in person ? Almost none of them. But, can we actually act without having to wait for politics to make announcements ? Not really I guess. The thing that I despise the most is that many of european politics are trying to say that we must accept migration in our countries without saying a word and to be welcoming. The question in my opinion is : Are we really ready to let people we know almost nothing about coming to our country and welcome them with open arms ?

I'm pretty sure everyone has his own convictions on this subject, and I respect that. The thing is that it's hard to say that there is a perfect solution to this problem and more importantly it's important to take into consideration that, having people coming to our country can be scary. As you probably all know, terrorists threaten France so I think it can be legitimate not to be as enjoyed by the idea as we should be according to politics.

To conclude what I dislike the most in this all situation is that, even though these people that are coming to Europe to save themselves are in really though position, nobody is thinking about what's happening next. Like always we react without being sure of what the consequences will be. Oh and just before ending this already long post, I think that Amandine was trying to say by mentionning homeless people in France is that we already have people who needs place to sleep and good living conditions right under our noses, and that even though we need to take care of migrants, we should not forget them, cause they also need our help Wink
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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Amandinelau on Tue Sep 29, 2015 9:02 pm

Thank you Alex. You've clarified my idea.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Gaëlle on Tue Sep 29, 2015 11:04 pm

About what I read previously, the point of view I share the most was developed by Eloïse.
I think in France we have enough spaces and resources to welcome some refugees, because for me Syrians are refugees, they didn't really choose to flee their country...
In France we have spaces deserted by people, and in my point of view those refugees who have qualifications wouldn't be against rebuilding cities in la Creuse for example, if they can have there a better life than the one they fled. This would be an emergency response to the situation.

Seeing it with a long term perspective, for me this isn't only a European matter, other powerful countries should propose their help in finding a solution to end those forced migrations.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Salvatore VENNETTILLI on Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:41 am

What a sbuject to start the year !
Well, i think first of all we need to make a differience between refugees and migrants. Migrant is the word we should use to talk about people that come in Europe to get a job to work and try to have a better life. Refugees are the people who leave their coutries beacuse they are being killed by the government or/and by a terrorist organisation. Migrants have come to Europe for decades. I'm a son of migrants. But the actual situation with refugees is quite different. They are trying to save their life. They just want to live in a peaceful country.

So, the europeen union is now facing a wave of thousands of people who come in our countries, and some countries do not want to welcome refugees. Lack of money ? General racism ? They will never admit the reason why they send those refugees in other countries and we can't really make them change their mind. What we can do in our rich and developped countries (germany, france...) is to welcome those people and help them till the war end or. It's what Italy did for the last 4 or  5 years since the war began in Libya and Syria. The island of lampedusa built many centers to welcome the refugees, cure them and offer them a place to live. It would be great if every country were rich and if there was not an economic crisis. But it's not the case ! Money may be one of the main reason why countries, and people are not willing to welcome all those refugees. And with that, this lack of money, people think that the governement gives more help to the refugees than they give to the poor people of their own country. That's wrong ! But it's hard to explain that to 70 million f***** brainless people. I can understand their point of view, but i totally  disagree with it
What was done by the germans and some people in the other countries that really helped hard the refugees is a fair solution. It's a temporary solution but i think it may be one.

To talk about the migrants, it's a bit more complicated. They are looking for a better life too, they want to have more money they want their children to go to school and have a safe house to sleep. But that's what we want too in Europe ! And if we can't even assure that for our people, how can we do to assure that for them too ? That's an argument that the extreme are using. But what they have in mind is a deeper racist feeling about all strangers.

Well, to conlcude i'd say that as human and for the respect of human rights we should help and welcome the refugees in the countries that have space and were people are willing to help them, because the government will not help that much. Some mayor in France have done a very good job helping the refugess, and we should follow their example.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Anaël Maublanc on Wed Sep 30, 2015 5:33 pm

It is an important subject of society yes...
I agree with Gaelle, there is a lot space in France for example but also in other Europe countries. German actually has problems to receive and put up all refugees, but some countries choose to close theirs borders and do not accept migrants whereas they belong to EUROPE as Hongary. The European government should to choose together a solution to welcome in fonction of their space all refugees. Why German will receive a thousand of migrants and other countries no people. Then, refugees who leave their country to have a better life and run away war should be on the same equal footing and receive the same welcome according to different Europe countries. We are human before everything, we cannot leave it alone children, women and men who just want to live a peaceful life without war, terrorism, without work, school and so on. This is the reason I think, they should find some common ground for all these refugees because actually Europe countries behave independantly according to their own interets (social, work...)

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Madagascan Lorriane on Wed Sep 30, 2015 6:40 pm

You guys' opinions are quite relevant. I won't have anymore things to say if this continues ! Embarassed I do share some opinions, like Eloïse's, Alex's, Amandine's and Salvatore's, BUT I do not totally agree with them. I think for now this situation is the best that the government can do. I agree with you Eloïse that European government takes too much time in finding solutions but this is a difficult situation because the way they'll react over this, might really or really not please European people so they can't help it. ( I am not saying that they are right here ) If they easily accept all refugees without taking into account which consequences that will have ( I don't only mean people-indoor's reactions by this but also from a financial perspective consequences ) then the situation will get worse in these European countries ( taking into account the fact that the situation was indeed already bad like what Alex says; as I interpreted ), though if they simply reject all this crew then it won't be politically correct. It is indeed a difficult dilemma here so for me all this was expected, and it won't move unless we throw off all equipment and people's reaction matters.

Frankly speaking, as for me, this situation really shows how human nature is, putting first their benefit. Well, as long as we are like this, it won't change. Just my poor opinion though cat

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Emma Herry on Thu Oct 01, 2015 3:35 pm


Here the link of a short and easy video about the syria refugees crisis.

This a major situation and I think the EU is not reacting as good as they sould. They are acting individually, not together. They are not agree on "quota" or what to do. they taking too much time on decisions and not actions. I think countries like France, German, Engand should and can welcome refugees. They have enough "space" but the problem, as alwyas, is money. We do, have in France Migrants, like England and Germany, and it's working. (actually almost workig) but more people can't "hurt" us. And these people need help and safety for a while. As Salvatore said it, it doesn't mean refugees gonna stay for ever ("instead of migrants") but they do, like migrants, looking for hope, better life.
Don't even talk about the middle east countries which are doing nothing instead of Jordan, Iraq, lebanon who are taking care of 95% of the refugees without a lot of money or confortable camps.
Talking about camps, in France we are destroying some and it's not a solution because other are made it somewhere else and it put people even more in difficulty to find a "good" camp (clean, with food, not cold or with deases) but they don't have any other options. What should you do if you were in the same situation?
Hoepfully some great organisations are doing amazing jobs, or great people wants to help like German or austrian people who are helping people with food, water, phones when they arrived. Or the three dutch men who created a airbnb for refugees (free of course).

Let's have hope and positive thoughts for the people who are in this difficult situation.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Emma Herry on Thu Oct 01, 2015 3:38 pm

Sorry I didn't gave you the link but the forum didn't allow me to do it. But if you go on youtube and write "European Refugees Crisis" and you click on the first video call : The european Refugees Crisis and Syrai Explained" It's a good vide, watch it! Smile

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by CamilaCristanchoDuque on Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:51 pm

To contextualize this issue in Colombia I have to write about three significant recent events, which are not considered for us like a «problem».
1. The arrival of many Spanish people: Because of the economic European crisis, a lot of Spanish people went to South America to start a new life, to work. Even if we have historically frictions, they are very welcomed in Colombia.
2. The arrival of Venezuelan people: Right now Venezuela have a very perturbing economic and political crisis, the violence has increased in the last years, there are few job opportunities and they do not even have the possibility to buy basic food; the best solution for them is to leave their country. Nowadays, Colombia offers many facilities thanks to strong development of its economy.
3. The expulsion of the Colombian people from Venezuela: Venezuela has a socialist political system and Colombia is almost the only country in South America with a right-wing government. This fact was good enough for their president to throw our people out.
In South America we have several problems, especially regarding social inequality, poverty, and political corruption but not with migrants. Why? Because we are a very united continent, we see ourselves as siblings, and as siblings we always try to help to each other. Our countries are always open, we are willing to share, and the «land» belongs to everyone, meaning that a "country" is only an imaginary division used to manage easily. However I also know that the cultural, political and economic differences between Europe and South America make of this a matchless problem, it is not possible to compare the situation we are living with the migration problematic in Europe, particularly in terms of time, size and impact.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by AlexiaChambinaud on Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:42 pm

Hello, OMG it's true that this is the most prevalent topic in the news over the last few weeks. But it doesn't believe it' a problem that lasts for years. The different countries in Europe don't know what to make of this situation but facing media interest, the leaders had to react and try to propose solutions. But to me, the solution isn't black or white, that's why this situation is complicated. But we can't simply close their eyes and let them die in their country. If every country contributed to welcome and integrate some of the migrants then the situation could argue, only it's not so easy. Indeed, for example Greece suffers a terrible financial crisis and unemployment is very high so it's hard for them to welcome and integrate migrants is not necessarily they not want, but they can't financially, economically ...

I find the positives in France, it's to have forced the refugees to study and learn French so that they can integrate more quickly. Another positive point is to have found something to their shelter. It's in moments where we see that mutual assistance is important and it must continue ....

In addition, organizations exist to help refugees to follow procedures of their new life. And I think the government should work with the agencies to unblock this situation.

To conclude, I think one of the real problems in France, is fear. We are full of prejudices and we're full of ideas about people or religions without seeking beyond, We tar with the same brush. You really overcome its prejudices and accept to help people. If we arrive to us that we would like someone we hold out your hand...


Thank you for your attention.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Marjorie Braud on Fri Oct 02, 2015 3:58 pm

The problem of these immigrants is related to the terrible life’s condition of their countries. We must help them first in their countries and therefore we can’ t stay without help them closing our doors. Maybe we could create more associations in order to give them food, clothes and a bed.
At the end, we are all the same, so we could have care of them trying to integrate and not to hinder. Also our grandfather, in the past, emigrated to other nations and living in poors conditions, so in memory to these fact we could use their testimony in order to not repeat these acts
The reaction of the govern is too much slow, they could talk with other European nation and develop a good plan to face this situation that is coming, day by day, more critical.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Manon Lopez on Sat Oct 03, 2015 10:36 am

Hello everyone,

The situation of migrants is more critical now, and I'm so sad to see that some people think we should close our borders in order not to put France for sauvegarde the economic situation, although I hear your arguments, that can be justified, but I can not conceive that leaves the Mediterranean become a human cemetery. We can not talk about human quotas, to me this world view is too personal and I saddens me that our policies right and left speakers to make quotas of immigrants in host countries.
We are not immune to the same experience, in a few years and I think we would be very upset if these countries applied the same legislation than us on immigration. If you cross the Mediterranean with his children being aware of the proven risk of mortality, it is estimated that because it is better than staying in her home country.
In the words of Marjorie, my grandfather fled Spain under the Franco regime to come to France, so I feel very concerned by what is happening in the world, and seeing the after-effect he is still keeping today, I think it would be inhuman to refuse migrants in our country.
I find it very well that Angoulême to participate in the host program, not only because it is a humanitarian cause, but also because I hope it will provide opportunities for reluctant of you to welcome strangers to meet and understand what they experienced ...


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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Romane Aubinel on Sat Oct 03, 2015 11:42 am

HELLOOO
Very Happy
Ah! Here is a complicated and delicate subject! Rolling Eyes

Europeans spread their divisions over the crisis of migrants, many countries oppose frontally to the policy advocated by Berlin to accommodate the wave of refugees continues to grow on the roads of Europe.

I think for me, the best way to help migrants
is to welcome them temporarily for shelter, protect their life, but they need help to return home upon completion of conflicts. Their place is there, in their country, they have a role to play in rebuilding their society in their culture, and also to help their compatriots them stayed there and suffering. it is also solidarity.

Syrian refugees are not fleeing poverty, do not come to enjoy France or whatever, they flee the war.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Alexandre Baudet on Sat Oct 03, 2015 4:36 pm

Quite a controversial subject to begin!

To my mind, I think that the different government have to cooperate to find a solution as soon as possible. In fact, in France, for example, this subject causes puerile debates between political parties whereas there are lives involved. But it’s a good thing that governments finally begin to react, and work together.

Firstly, I think it is a duty to welcome these migrants temporarily because they are leaving difficult situations in they countries. There is no miracle solution and this is the least we can do.
Many countries are still closed for the reception of migrants and want to close their borders. But don’t forget that they are human, and they need help. I'll be curious to see our behavior if we were in their situation.

Then, I think we’ll should find a solution to try to calm the crisis countries and make them less volatile. One solution could be to try to revive their growth and partially resolve their instability. In fact, if countries were in a better situation, migrants wouldn’t be as many.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by marinealbertpieri on Sat Oct 03, 2015 5:20 pm


In the first part, i want to highlight some post, like's of Manon who speaks about the false excuse of EU about our "economic situation", and when she speak about his grand father a refugee who fled Spain of franco, exactly like my grand mother. Camila gives me back some hope, when she talk about the welcoming in Colombia, and this idea that the land is to no one, i'm totally agree with his point of view. Salvator who began with the important difference that we should all do between migrant and refugees. And Eloise who explained well, that helping  refugees would never be wrong for homeless people.

To talk about  this situation, i would like explain some of my ideas before.
I learned some years ago, that France, before the II WW, and even before she becomes a country, will live never a peaceful time of more than fifty years. so, this country and his people who suffered of war's repeat, let unconsciously enter in his culture the stranger like a danger. And now i understand that it's still complicated to welcoming the stranger with no fear. (but i do not endorse)
I would speak too, about Dadaab, it's the biggest refugees camp in the world, was created in 1990 and it's still exist today, it was supposed to be temporary ! The problem it's that no one cares about when and where this people will be reintroduce in real "free" life, today some child was born in this camp and so they have no nationalities and no culture to identify them self. That's why i think camp it's not a good idea.

To ending, i think the solution is in the hands of governments of EU, i mean for once they could take an european decision together, and make a real welcoming politic and stop to give us the argument of economics because this argument should not be consider when lifes are on the game. This people are in emergency situation, they walk along all the european continent and they just want to be protect and welcoming.
So, like Michel Rocard said "We can not welcome all the misery of the world, but we must to take his portion."



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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by WANG RUI on Sun Oct 04, 2015 12:01 pm

That is a new topic for me, beacause in my country, we haven't the similar problem. In Chine, although le government refuges the people from the others countries, most of them are for the others raisons not for the raison politique. Like the famous american spy Snowden, he tried to take refuge in Chine,but not succeeded. I think the chinese government is cautious for the problem of refuge, and there is already the problem of population and of resources in our coutry, so the large-scale of refuge is not allowed in our country.
For the present situation in France, il don't think the Syrian/Afghan/Iraqi refugees migrate in the others countries european is the solution for long-term. The principal problem is the conflict of their country, must this problem is solved, if not, the problem will become more and more troublesome, even trigger the others problems, like security of society in the countries which refuge

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Florian MICHEL on Sun Oct 04, 2015 6:31 pm

Hello everybody !
For me it’s difficult to have a fix point of view.
First, I understand the migrant problem and why they come here because of the situations in their countries. The problem is EU can’t accept all the migrants with the actual economic situation but we have to accept some of them. For me, we have to identifie good migrants and bad migrants because some of them come in EU only for social helps ans some others come and learn languages ans work.
In this situation, I can’t have a clear point of view because of amalgamate.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by JulieLhommede on Mon Oct 05, 2015 8:09 am

the migrant's situation is a real poblem in Europe. Germany, Italy, France..Europe is not ready to support them, and the lack of time ans infrastructures can not permise to greet this families
Parents and children left their war's country; hope a new life, security and education. A dream.

But in reality this migrants are threat like products, ship from island to island. They go on a touristic cruise on the road of death...to avoid the gun'sball, guards ...
Once arrived in Europe, the migrant's product continue, they are stocked in camps and wait a country accept them....

It's horrible ! They are men ! Where is the respect for human right ?

Maybe humanities action can educate ans guide migrants to prevent against this trafic, this human business

But I haven't got a real solution ... I m not a president Smile

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

Post by Laure on Mon Oct 05, 2015 1:02 pm

I don't really know what to say about it. I have the chance to have an amazing family with values and they act about it. I'm from Pas-de-Calais, kind of close to Calais and in my hometown (a village actually), there is a lot of migrants who want to go to England. My two aunts are part of an association (Terre d'errance) which help migrants. They are all outside in a field called the jungle. The association gives them something to eat, organises showers in local stadium once a week, takes care of their health also (sometimes women are pregnant).
I think helping that kind of association is the best that citizens can do.

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Re: The first topic : The Refugee/Migrant situation

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