Subject M2 Pack : Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité. We have none.

Hi there!

This week we have to talk about our great French motto, youhouuuuuuuuuuuu.
I think saying we don't have nothing of Freedom, Equality or Brotherhood must be exagerate because a lot of other countries don't have our freedom or liberty level. In an other way, these recent years we are facing in France and in all Europe in general, to the rise of hatred. Waves of religious, racial, homosexuals hatred AND also recently jews hatred !! So for me in france the Brotherhood value become more and more meaningless and that sucks. Every day in France we can heard people in TV or radio having racist speech and that is not acceptable for me. But for example because of "liberty expression" we can heard Zemmour saying that the name "Hapsatou" is an insult to our country because it is not a french name. Some (many) french people always fear of the difference and it is a recurrent and important issu, which have to change.
In an other way, I think the notion of equality is evolving when we talk about women's right. In France, at least, Feminism is a current subjet and a lots of people, not only womens, are acting in the good way to make womens the equal of mens in terms of wages etc.

Hi !!!
I would like to speak about the last SCANDAL in "Elysée Shop".
This is a screenshot of the Elysée Shop :


We can see only, White, Blue, Red.....and White, Blue, Red................
In the website, we can see the gold bracelet which name is "LIBERTE", with the "lovely" price of 250 euros. What is the price of liberty in France according to you ?


In fact, the Elysée shop is a very BIG, BIG, BIG business (350.000 euros in 3 day according to the huffingtonpost during the heritage days) with derivative products. The favorite is the "french watch" wearing by our President.


I am going to speak about the last scandal in Elysée shop. The other favorite is the "Elysée" mug with the indispensable "made in France" and "Porcelaine de Limoges". But, ...... the mug is not from/in "porcelaine de limoges" but from other region (maybe China !!!!) .... And the most incroyable is that......in spite of is not from limoges....the mug is still the favorite !!!!!!

Hi !

For me, in France, we have a part of freedom, Equality and Brotherhood. We live in a country where people fought for give us a better life with good values.
For example, in some country womens right to vote only since 2005 and she doesn't give their opinion. Here, we can be considered our opinion and our power.
However, the society change constlanty and she must adapt in fonctions. But it's hard to change practices and minds.
Today, even if the womens assert their individuality, their salary stay smaller compared with mens for the same skills and the same work.
In the daily life, it's difficult to apply freedom, equality and brotherhood. Its like a slider, in some domains, the mens are avantages and in other there are womans.
Its so complicated to satisfy all the people, but in France we live generally in a good environment.

Marion, I heard about it, if even the Elysee denigrates Limoges city...

I think we are lucky to live in a free country. We are free to choose our studies, our professional life, our associates ... We can travel without problem and do what we want. Of course there are certain prohibitions, but these prohibitions seem to me justified to allow a good cohabitation. We are in a country that is evolving in favor of freedom, for example with the legalization of marriage for everyone. Regarding equality it isn't always obvious, we are in a country where there is still racial discrimination and integration difficulties. Especially concerning migrants, many French people show egoism by refusing to welcome them, considering that they will have to share state aid, that they will have to contribute for them...

Are we looking for equality of result or more simply equality of opportunity?

I love this motto. It's such a beautiful thing. Do we have none? It's a tough question.

Some people trust it, and they apply it. They help others people, they love others people, and they do it without prejudice. I think most of people don't care if you are small, tall, homosexual, black, green, ginger, etc. It's your life, they accept it, and they treat you with equity.

And some people are useless bastards. They want you to live how they live, or how you "should live" according to them. We hear them a lot, and that's sad.

At a national scale, we can't trust our own motto. Parcoursup is a joke and a disaster, our great Presidential King Macron put himself on Elyseum goodies. He said that you can't have an opinion if you can't earn your own life, that a simple t-shirt won't impress him... And some measures to take to weaker citizen in order to help richer citizen. We talk about borders, about migrants as numbers and not as lifes...

People can be human, but do they want to sacrify their lifestyle for others? For the moment, I'm sad that our great country is managing its citizen like it does.

I always loved this motto. Since I was a kid in middle school learning about the French Revolution. It always seemed to me that Liberté, Egalité and Fraternité was a result of the population awakening to the inequality of opportunities and their force as a nation. Everything seemed do good and genuine on my school books.

Well, now I honestly don't see much difference between France and all the other modern democracies in the world. This country also has to deal with the far right politics that are really popular thanks to a part of the population that sympathize with some fascist ideas. Don't get me wrong, I really like France, but it's just like any other country that doesn't have the motto Liberté, Egalité and Fraternité.

Hi !

"Liberté, égalité, fraternité", a motto that represents France and which some countries envy us, especially because we live in a free country, a democracy, where all French citizens are equal to the right to vote.

A motto that was not so long ago that it was shaken during 4 years under the regime of Marshall Petain, by the motto "Travail, Famille, Partie". With this new motto, the marshall wanted to build a new state model, more paternalise, corporatist, and even authoritarian.

I agree with you Mélody when you say "we are free to choose his studies, his professional life ...". And I also totally agree when you mention the issue of migrants. The fraternity doesn't seem to be shared by all the French when it comes to evoking subjects such as welcoming immigrants. This fraternal solidarity that is put forward, is sometimes a little quickly forgotten, facing some problems...

Have a nice week end !

Some people are happy with their lives and don't want some perturbation from the other countries.
As enybody else, they don't want to be affected by migrant crisis, terrorist attacks, food crisis, but these people simply

In other regions of France, there are people who would do anything to help the victims. Social networks always anable to coordinate help delivery, wether it is messages or supplies.
So we see an e-fraternité building up and people taking action physically.

Liberté and égalité are values that can be discussed.
I think these two values only exist in small groups of people, we don't feel FREE as a whole nation. Liberté is personnal.

Egalité is even more personnal, eveyone has its own definition of égalité.

Are we looking for equality of result or more simply equality of opportunity?

I think that this question depends on the point of view, for me the equality of chances is more important because it allows people of all origins and social classes to be able to do the same studies, or work as others. We must not promise the same result if the means to achieve it are different. Equality of opportunity makes it possible to show what the person is capable of independently of any other factor.

Yes Virginie, and the First Article of Vth Republican Constitution says that :
« Article Premier. Tous les êtres humains naissent libres et égaux en droits »

But in reality, this is more complex to ensure equality of chances. Everyone is categorized with an "etiquette" and opinions/beliefs are what destroy the chances to have 100% equality .

Hi there !
I can read that we all agree more or less with our motto. Sure our country is not perfect in terms of liberty, equality, and fraternity. But I think we don't have to be ashamed, because we're not bad neither. We are an open-minded country, we have no racial or religious laws, or depending on the gender, we have a lot of freedom in our life choices (of course we have self limits, but nothing is impossible because of the country). We are in a rich country, and even if french people are always complaining, we have a lot of advantages from the economical situation of the country. Acutally it's really french to complain ! If we go in other countries, even in Europe, not so far from here, we can see a lot of inequality, and less freedom. And we cannot say that we are not free in France.
If we talk about equality, there are still some differences between people, for example between the women and the men who are working for the same job, we know that most of the time the women are paid less than the men. And about fraternity, one of the best example is being host for the migrants. Some french people are still against that, and against the equal pay between women and men, but I think they are less and less and for most of them they are pretty old, now with our young generations, things will change for sure. And maybe right now our motto is not perfectly representative of France, but it will be in the future.

Hi!

Indeed, if we compare France to other countries in the world, we have equality between men and women apparently: right to vote, right to abortion... In addition, France accepts all religions, even if some minority very present on the social networks shows the opposite. In order to achieve equality for all the religons, laws were created to have no apparent religious object at school.

But, if we look in depth, there are really inequalities. Indeed, the wages of men and women for the same job are not equal. A study led by Marie-Anne Valfort has frighteningly shown that: as soon as the name sounds Muslim and, especially, when the candidate is a man, response rates collapse massively. Worse still, having the best training courses, having the best possible internships, etc., has virtually no effect on the response rates of boys of Muslim origin.

We can therefore conclude that compared to other countries, our motto is "respected" but, we still have a long way to go before it is really right.[/b]

Hello !! As Justine says, I think that we are in an open-minded country. And a lot of people before us were fighting to have the rights we have today. Of course, there is some problems (racism, equality between mens and women, homophobia...) in our society but it's our role to fight against it. We need to remember that some everyday acts that look normal for us are not normal in other countries. For example the right for a girl to go to school or abortion... So I think we have freedom, equality, brotherhood but there could be even more